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LittleBite-sizedPlanet Omnibus Thread


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#1
waffle_king23

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Ossu!

 

So, one thing that's come up with Roughly 15 Fresh is its inflexibility. As much as i love making it, it's not something i can just toss together; and the rules we've set for ourselves, while making for eclectic and enjoyable playlists, are, in the end, limitations.

 

i figured, i'd toss together a side series, something more stripped down, and a little broader in scope. i'll be using it to take a look at one level an episode with basically no restrictions. It'll also be a place for me to put tutorials (when i feel like making them), and community discussions/rants (when the opportunity arises.

 

It'll also be something i can continue making indefinitely, conceivably. i'm not saying that R15F will be going away when the first season's year is up, but it's a possibility i have to at least consider.

 

So we've got an intro episode up here

 

Also, a first real episode up here.

 

In our first episode we take a look at Grind a Rail! from erik08032000, which is interesting, but has its issues.

 

So...let me know how you feel about all this. We'll be keeping everything in one big thread, because updates will be unscheduled (though definitely at least one a week).


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#2
waffle_king23

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Coming back around for Round Two!

 

We're taking a look at Heart of the Flip-side from Trindall, a four-course meal of old-school, batter-fried LBP1 goodness. Come see the greatness of LBP1-era logic, and waffleking23 completely missing the plot.


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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Community Levels first impressions - Roughly 15 Fresh!

#3
chronos453

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Coming back around for Round Two!

 

We're taking a look at Heart of the Flip-side from Trindall, a four-course meal of old-school, batter-fried LBP1 goodness. Come see the greatness of LBP1-era logic, and waffleking23 completely missing the plot.

 

Looking back as a creator, LBP1 levels were really something. I think the fascinating part about LBP1-era levels was that visuals were merely secondary, while innovation is what really shines. However, making a level that excels in both gameplay and visuals was definitely no easy feat, and were levels I often looked up to for inspiration. Ironically, I never actually made anything (besides a crummy R1 race) within that era, but I'll get into that later.

 

Since we're on the topic of LBP1-era levels, I'd like to share a few of my personal favorites that remain fresh in my memory today. Keep in mind, I may be putting these on a high pedestal, but you know how nostalgia is:

 

Maxed Out by Qugz

This was an insane mess that somehow worked out in the end. It sacrificed a solid theme and visual flare to make way for logic/physics setpieces that would absolutely blow your mind, doubly so if you were knowledgeable with LBP1 logic. But I guess the creator wasn't satisfied with just one installment, because there are actually three full Maxed Out levels with crazy contraptions. 

 

Distress in Ocean by YAMAME3(?)

I'm sure I'm not the only one who considers this level to be a legend. This level had a fun setting, a solid design, and a whole lot of heart. It continues to remain as one of my all-time favorite "underwater" levels despite not actually having functional water in it because how creative the level utilized its sea creatures. I really liked how the winch swings had fish stickers plastered on them, or how you would use the Zs of a giant sleeping crab to ascend to a higher platform (then you get to ride that giant sleeping crab), or how the squids are propelled by rockets, and who could forget that glorious chase sequence against that shark (and the retaliation afterwards)?

 

And it gets better. This is one of those rare cases where making the level copyable is a good thing, because now I get to look at all the ground work behind it (and I recommend you do the same, it's fascinating stuff). By the way, I put a question mark next to this creator's name since I'm unsure whether or not this is the original creator (though judging from the stats, I'd like to think it is).

 

Carp [JPN] by o-tera

Carp is probably my favorite o-tera level with Ruins of the Roller as a close second. The level is incredibly simplistic in both gameplay and visuals, but is a very fun experience for beginners like me back in the day. It's also a very good learning experience for new creators when it comes to platformers since it tackles the basics so well. Even now I would recommend playing through this level as reference to any player looking to make their own platformers.

 

(Note: This was originally an LBP1 level, though it seems like it was updated in LBP2)

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Phew.

 

That took a while to get through. I probably have more levels to gush over but this should be a good selection for now. Now that I'm re-reading this post, it looks like I'm trashing on the LBP2/3 era. But I don't think that at all, in fact, it was thanks to the improvements made in these titles that I was able to make what I wanted (fun fact: I made my very first platformer in LBP2, even Lockstitch reviewed it!). 2 and 3 were able to fulfill my needs for a sort of perfect balance between gameplay and visuals, which was something I could never really achieve in the LBP1 era.

 

Oh, I never really touched upon the level in this episode that much, did I?


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#4
katanagirl1

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Yeah chronos453, it is truly amazing what some LBP1 creators were able to do with so very little true logic! When I got the first game I immediately picked up the second so I could go to creating there, since there was so much more to work with. I don't have any LBP1 levels published.

I've got a busy weekend in store, so I'll have to catch up on all your new stuff later!
:)
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#5
waffle_king23

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That looks like a nice set of levels, Chronos! i'd love to take a look at some of the LBP1 gems. i wasn't much involved in the community then, so i missed most of them. i might take a look at that Egyptian on KG'd mentioned in the last R15F thread (or the one before?).

Funny story, but your first platformer was one of the few levels i'd actually hearted waaaaaay back in the day. i'd completely forgotten until i started looking through that list for the new series.

@kg, LBP1 logic is nuts. i'd never even thought about everything that went into Flip-side when i'd first played it, just naively thought it was in-camera, getting to the dev room for the first time was a heck of a thing.

Thanks, both of you, for the support! Hope y'have a fine day!
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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#6
waffle_king23

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Alright, picked up a review request a bit back, so i figured i'd put it up here

Level's Lucky Block Edition with Toggle! by king_birds.

It's solid dig-dugian level, not something i'm super into, but good none-the-less.
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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#7
katanagirl1

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Lucky Block with Toggle - this was more like a survival challenge, it didn't make me think of Dig Dug because you couldn't travel freely in any direction, you had to move downward to keep up with the level.  It's more like Tetris or other mobile games.  Good points about the music and the use of Toggle for the level.

 

Heart of the Flip-side - nice gameplay with the whole level rotating!  I haven't seen that in a long time!  Yep, it's like eveything in those old levels is physics-based, it's amazing what logic they could create with just that!  It does make for a complicated mess, though.

 

Grind a Rail - this is a really nice grindrail level, I've never seen this one.  I'm impressed with the quality of the gameplay.  It's a little hard to time the jumps when things are moving towards you.  Perhaps if they were more solid and less transparent it would help, or a health bar to let you know how much damage you have taken.

 

Roughly 15 Fresh is a great format, with the first impressions type look at a level, but as you pointed out its length is more difficult for you in terms of editing, and requires a longer time commitment for viewers.  This new, shorter format works well for me, and probably others as well since it's a smaller chunk of time each time.  Viewers might be able to watch more if they do it more frequently but more often.  It seems like a win-win for everyone!

 

Sorry I didn't get around to commenting on the bite-sized levels on YouTube since I has so much catching up to do!


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#8
waffle_king23

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Thanks KG! i'm enjoying the format as well, it fits a space i can't quite reach with Roughly 15Minutes (and vice versa).

 

You're right about Lucky Block not quite being DigDug, but it was the first thing that popped in my mind when playing. i don't know enough about trends to levels in the Community, i do wonder if that it's a prevalent style, if they'd gone with Toggle to make it stand out a bit more. i do wish they'd included at least a little music, though.

 

Can't quite go so far as to say the gameplay wowed me in Grind a Rail, it felt really sloppy and loose when i was playing, and it was really hard to gauge how to get myself right on the rails. There's actually no HP in the level, though i made the same mistake myself. The rings actually kill you right out when they're hit, it was one of the reasons i thought the beginning was too hard off the bat.

 

Interestingly, i got a nice response from Eric outlying some of what was going on behind the scenes.

 

 

 

Thanks a lot for the review! Unfortunately i couldn't implement the restart mechanic in-game because of a logic bug. I was trying to figure out a way around but it just didn't work. The logic behind it's probably very different from the other levels of the competition that had the possibility to restart. I'm sorry that you find the start to be "too hard" and you were dying a lot. The spawnrate of the rings it's the same for the whole stage, it changes only when you change the location, so it wasn't really under my control, there was a lot of RNG involved. My idea was to make the controls feel more LBP-ish and less arcade game, they're basically the same controls of LBP and you just needed to jump between three platforms, but i understand that it may take a while to get used to it.

 

It's always interesting to see some of what goes into production.


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#9
waffle_king23

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Ossu! Got another bite over here.

 

We've finally gotten around to Valley of the Kings by ima_taka. It's certainly a thing, mostly a good thing. Watch us find the break, like an Easter Egg. Super thanks to KatanaGirl1 for the heads up on this one!


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#10
katanagirl1

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Ooh, I can't wait to see this one! Did you find all the secrets???
It's too late here to watch, I'll have to squeeze in some time tomorrow!
;)

UPDATE:

I didn't know this level was broken in LBP3, I played it in LBP1 and LBP2 and it worked there.  One more reason to criticize LBP3, backwards compatibility was their buzzword back then.

 

It's interesting that your main gripe is the flame and horrible gas and that you can't tell what layer you're in.  You always say you like a flat camera for various reasons, and this isn't even a flat camera, so it makes me wonder.  The challenge is to keep track of what layer you are in, and watch the obstacles to move back and forth.

 

I found that section challenging, but the level was so interesting I kept playing because I wanted to see more!

 

Again, there is a Valley of the Kings II, and they both have secrets that take a really long time to find.  I guess that was the draw for me.  I had to find them all!

 

I'm glad you played the level and reviewed it, but sort of feel the same way as when you hear this song that you think is so awesome, and when you play it for your best friend they're like "meh".  Well, I guess that is a good example of how we are all different!

 

Thanks for being a good sport and giving it a go!

:)


Edited by katanagirl1, 24 June 2017 - 04:56 PM.

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#11
waffle_king23

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Aah! i need to work on my technique, i think...something's going on, but my voice has been kind of pants for selling my enthusiasm recently.

My issues with the fire/gas sections are similar, but divergent, and neither of them were really cameras. With the fire, i felt the section was not undoable, but that a mistake was too likely to throw me directly into another hazard, obviating the one hit grace you get with the flame hazard (something i usually like, cause i've seen it used to let players hit jumps they shouldn't be able to). Combined with the placement of the hazards and it's easy to get in a spawnlock, where i'd pop out the checkpoint, hit a hazard immediately, bounce into another and die.
With the gas, it was that i couldn't get where the hazard's edges were, because of the way the gas was whisping off. Serious question, but was horrible gas less...gassy in LBP1 and 2? Did they change the object's animation in 3 (that's happened with materials, right?)?

i feel a touch bad it didn't hook me quite the same as it did you. i'm wondering, now, how much of that might be down to its getting mangled a bit in the transition to LBP3. Man, now i kind of want to pick up a PS3 and LBP2 to see if some of those issues don't play more smoothly.
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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#12
katanagirl1

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At least the platform constantly moving (plus the infinite checkpoint) meant you did eventually make it past that section. It would certainly be bad if you were completely unable to progress. I guess that's why I would hesitate to call the level broken in the case of being unable to see the lights that the 3 way switches controlled. "Broken level" implies you were not able to finish the level. It does seem to have some broken parts, though.

I have noticed that LBP3 has a problem with lights not being visible in certain layers. It's almost like the player has to be in the same layer as the light. I would not have expected it to be a problem with an old level that is only 3 layers wide, but I guess it can be. In LBP3 levels that are much wider, you can definitely see the effect. I guess the camera cannot deal with the extra depth adequately. I wonder what level LBP3 assigns the older LBP1 and 2 levels too? Would that be the front three or the back three?

Did this level have a long sliding part with firey obstacles that required jumping in it? That might have been Valley of the Kings II. That part blew me away!
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#13
waffle_king23

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Hmm...this is a good point, and a reminder to be more precise in my terms, "this thing is broken and may stop progress if you don't know about it" vs. "this level is broken." Though if Valley of the Kings hadn't been popular enough for someone else to record way back when, i wouldn't have figured out the light issue most likely.
i was very happy the block was moving in the fire and gas sections (even just from a mechanical standpoint that was probably my favourite thing).
This one was definitely the first one, i'm going to have to make time to try out the second someday.
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#14
waffle_king23

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Heyos! Got a new episode up and coming over hereabouts.

 

This go about we're looking at The Level about Elevators from Paczek321. A good platformer with a great presentation. As for a racer...

 

Anyhow, it's a good 'um, so give it a look, yeah?


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#15
katanagirl1

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In The Level about Elevators, there seems to be lots of things in the level that force the player to slow down in many ways - to get the jumps onto the parts that move outward to push the player for instance.  You mentioned the backtracking, that would be okay but it did seem to require the player to go back a considerable distance, so I agree with you.  Your preference for racing levels to have the score bubbles is noted, but the player's score is also strongly influenced but the amount of time needed to complete the level.  Most racing levels have score bubbles for extra points, but personally I'm okay with them not having them.

 

I really feel like this level needs a better title to sell the level.  Judging by the title alone, I probably wouldn't even bother to look it up on lbp.me.  It sounds like a level where you just walk around in an empty level and ride elevators, or a gallery level that gives away elevator prizes.  Something catchy would help, or something to let the player know it's a fast-paced level.


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#16
waffle_king23

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i like score bubbles for the feeling of momentum the multiplier can give. You're right that they're not entirely necessary, but it's a little extra oomph. i think the level would work fine without the racing aspect, really, maybe fleshed out a little bit; the slow downs wouldn't be quite as noticeable that way. The title's a little weird, but kind of attractive in a Seinfeldian way, it's so blase it catches the eye.


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#17
LittleBlackadder

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Great episode on "A level about elevators". I also really liked the LBP2 Factory of a better tomorrow, materials, decorations, design and saving sackbots too :D

At about 5:35 to 5:55 in your video you mention "cruft" and "crufted". What does cruft mean" :Worried:


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#18
waffle_king23

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Great episode on "A level about elevators". I also really liked the LBP2 Factory of a better tomorrow, materials, decorations, design and saving sackbots too :D

At about 5:35 to 5:55 in your video you mention "cruft" and "crufted". What does cruft mean" :Worried:

 

Cruft is all the little details in a scene or on a set that aren't necessary to the action taking place, but give a sense of being an actual, lived-in environment. Posters on bedroom walls in sitcoms, dents and scratches in tables. Coffee mugs and family photos on desks. In LBP cruft is mostly in decorations and stickers, but can be done through materials as well. Non-interactive sackthings or creatures can be cruft as well. Basically, when done well, it helps the level look like more than just a department store display; but thanks to the engine we've got, when overdone, you get all the slowdown and loading issues we often see (especially when it's coupled with high-speed movement).


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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#19
katanagirl1

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I looked up "cruft" in Oxford dictionary and here's what I got:

Badly designed, unnecessarily complicated, or unwanted code or software.

Sound like my whole career in a nutshell
:p:
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#20
waffle_king23

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I looked up "cruft" in Oxford dictionary and here's what I got:

Badly designed, unnecessarily complicated, or unwanted code or software.

Sound like my whole career in a nutshell
:p:

 

The first place i can clearly remember seeing the term was in one of Tycho's posts over on Penny Arcade, and that would've been years ago. It wouldn't shock me to find that it started life as a programming term and evolved into something more general from there. i do know i like the sound of it better than filigree, which it bears resemblance to.


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時計仕掛けの子の丸々太った磁器の顔に表情は無いが、転がりながら、口がカチッと開閉して、腕が上下に動い た。
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