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Team Pick levels that block reviews

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#1
katanagirl1

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I've had some time to play some of the levels that have accumulated in my queue the last couple of days. I played a really good adventure level yesterday that got a Team Pick. I don't normally enjoy those types of levels, and I thought this one had great level design and was quite unique in some of the gameplay it had. I struggled a bit because it had limited checkpoints in the really tricky areas, but infinite checkpoints everywhere else. I also had to replay it because my save file space was full when I started, and got burned by those limited checkpoints mentioned earlier, about halfway through the adventure.

So, I was feeling somewhat proud of myself that I got all the way to the end. When I did, I found that reviews had been disabled. As a whole, this was an excellent level, and I would have had good things to say about it. I was just wondering what you guys thought - is it fair to players to block reviews on a Team Pick? I understand that bad people can post negative things. You can have offensive stuff reported. Some people post "pos" on my levels - I just leave it there because it makes them look like idiots.

I could put some stuff in the comments, but I was somewhat put off about the whole matter. It's not like when the reviews were broken in the earlier version of this game. Maybe this guy/gal had a bad experience, but in general, shouldn't a creator hear feedback from the people who play his/her level? If I really wanted to bad mouth this level, I could have done so in the comments as well.
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#2
ILoveI6v6I

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Well the only person being hurt by it is the creator. If they disabled the ability to leave feedback, then they probably won't gain anything from it anyway. I don't agree with disabling reviews, but it's better than those creators who delete any review that's even slightly negative while keeping all the perfect reviews. I don't mean troll reviews, I mean constructive criticism like "A very beautiful level, a few small issues with cameras but other than that it was a treat to play". Yes I know some creators who delete reviews like that. Personally, I leave all the feedback on my levels alone unless a troll says something obscene, in that case I report it.

 

There was a crown contest awhile back (I forgot which one) and one level was amazing but there was some issue that was preventing people from reaching the scoreboard. There was no way to tell the creator because he disabled all reviews/comments on his level and profile, and he ended up never fixing the issue.


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#3
katanagirl1

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Yeah, I hear what you are saying.  In that case you mentioned, he just hurt himself in the long run.  It might have even cost him the contest.

 

Maybe someone did have a problem with this particular level, I don't know.  In general, I think that by allowing reviews you take ownership of the level.  I suppose I would have still played it even if I knew beforehand that I couldn't leave a review.  It just sort of spoiled the whole experience for me, that my opinion wasn't worth hearing.


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#4
Pookachoo

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Well, I think everyone has the right to completely ignore what other people think of them or their work :)


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#5
EnochRoot

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Pc Principal would be so proud of those who try and engineer a safe space away from any dissenting opinions or differing perspectives....learning to ignore obvious trolls and internet idiocy is part of growing up in todays internet interfaced linked in social media slanted society. Constructing walls and barriers against negative behaviour can also lead to a narrowed delusional world view.

Give me honest open free speech any day....if people post caustic troll reviews/comments just ignore them but sometimes there is a kernel of truth contained within or an enlightening opinion. Some of the second rate Steven picks have seen reviews and comments disabled when players make suggestions or question his tatse and judgement...creators should seek any source of feedback they can get if they honestly wish to improve.

f61b001f-b570-4d1c-a262-4a4d7ed5a5ea_zps

 

 

It may also be worth noting it may not be just the creators disabling reviews....I published a LBN ghost train level and the reviews  suggested people enjoyed the level and agreed vociferously about Sumos short comings highlighted within the level...suddenly the reviews are mysteriously disabled?..hmmmm...a LBP3 bug or censorship?


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Ironically, irony is wasted on those with no sense of ironism...Oh the irony!
 


#6
Pookachoo

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At one point I noticed that the reviews on one of mine were unintentionally disabled, either I did that by accident on LBP.me or it's a bug.


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#7
blacksackman

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I honestly think that it's very wrong to block out opinions from other players. Sometimes trolls breaks the fundamental laws of what an honest opinion is, and in those cases I think that it's fine to delete the unwanted review. 

 

The worst case scenario is when creators completely disable everything, even their profile comments. Like, how are we supposed to show our appreciation to those creators? Surely you can maybe contact him/her through PSN, but what if they changed their privacy settings there as well. If people want to hide behind their privacy settings and block out all feedback and criticism, why even share their creation in the first place? Some creators are just too sensitive. 

 

Everyone should have the right to express their opinion, players should not be allowed to disable comments or reviews unless they have a legitimate reason to do so. And I mean REAL reasons, not just because you don't want your criticism to be visible. But no matter what, the privacy settings are increasing and soon you will be able block just about everything... Why not add a feature that makes your name invisible to other players as well? It wouldn't surprise me if they add this feature in future games.... Remove those walls and open up your mind to opinions from other people! 


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#8
katanagirl1

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Well, I think everyone has the right to completely ignore what other people think of them or their work :)


I had to read this a couple of times. You could interpret "ignore" as hearing their opinion and not heeding it, or not listening at all (blocking it completely). I'm not entirely sure which way you intended now! That's funny in an ironic sort of way!

Thanks everyone for sharing your opinions. As with opinions, of course they are not right or wrong. They are not facts to be disputed. I'm just glad to hear that I'm not the only one who feels this way.
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#9
Pookachoo

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Well, I think everyone has the right to completely ignore what other people think of them or their work :)


I had to read this a couple of times. You could interpret "ignore" as hearing their opinion and not heeding it, or not listening at all (blocking it completely). I'm not entirely sure which way you intended now! That's funny in an ironic sort of way!

Thanks everyone for sharing your opinions. As with opinions, of course they are not right or wrong. They are not facts to be disputed. I'm just glad to hear that I'm not the only one who feels this way.

 

I was meaning either - but if a creator doesn't care at all and won't read comments anyway, I guess I think it's more honest to simply turn off the comments so players know the situation :P

 

In general, I really don't like to see comments/reviews disabled and sometimes I've taken levels out of my queue because I felt like I didn't want to play if feedback wasn't welcome. But I guess I'd rather see reviews disabled than someone who just deletes everything.

On the other hand, disabling reviews can be really handy for certain things, like levels that aren't really meant to be played. I have an adventure slot on my planet that's just an archive of all the scenes I made for GIFs in 2014. All the levels in it are locked, but since you can't lock an adventure I kept getting reviews complaining that there was nothing to do, so disabling all reviews/comments was the best option there. Another level I have is just for sharing objects, where players have to hold certain buttons to access a prize bubble. If someone who wasn't meant to get that prize figures out the button combo that's fine, but I don't want them posting what that combo is in the comments.

 

Anyway, those are my feeling about the ability to disable comments/reviews in general.

As for team picked levels in particular, I think those get picked on a lot and the community tends to hold them to a different standard (that happens to any artist with a little fame). Creator's of team picked levels should still have the same options as everyone else though, it would only cause more separation if team picked levels couldn't disable comments.


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#10
one-mad-bunny

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The only thing I don't like about negative reviews is the lemming effect.  A bad review at the top of the list tends to influence players before they even play, making them look for the level's shortcomings, and they jump on the bandwagon.  There have been a few times when a level was team picked that wasn't amazing that I was actually relieved to see the reviews disabled.  Sure the community has the right to free speech, but this is a game that is supposed to be fun.  Getting a host of bad reviews on something you made isn't fun.

 

Constructive criticism  isn't a bad review.  I think it's easier said than done to ignore the trolls, especially when they smell blood in the water.


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#11
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@bunny  -very true!

 

I'm all in favor of the right to free speech, but that right is for people to express themselves, it doesn't entitle anyone to an audience. Player's can still write reviews online or even dedicate a level to reviewing another level (I've seen it done), so as I see it, disabling reviews is not impending free speech. Except for when we had that awful Progressive advertising level - that was not a normal community created level, it was placed in LBP by the forces of marketing and when the community complained in reviews/comments, all were disabled. That was a higher power silencing the community voice, which to me is censorship.


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#12
AL2009man

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Everyone should have the right to express their opinion, players should not be allowed to disable comments or reviews unless they have a legitimate reason to do so. And I mean REAL reasons, not just because you don't want your criticism to be visible.

 

It happened to me with a certain person getting offended to my satire levels. at one point, he/she attacked me and my levels. resulting me to edit that level (twice) until he/she's satisfied. (basically, a SWJ before SWJ went popular)

 

it was a horrible experience for me back in LBP2 waaay before I matured myself.

 

the good news that I recorded a uncensored, unedited version in my Youtube Channel, in potato cam.

 

Constructive Criticism is fine, but don't be a jerk about it.


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#13
katanagirl1

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Yeah, I've had that happen.  I don't edit my levels to please other people if it's not what I want to do.  I take their comments into consideration, but after all it is my level, not theirs.  Some people just can't state their opinion and then move on.  It can get nasty.

 

I had to block someone for that very reason.  I was getting 5-6 messages each day attacking me personally.  I hated to have to do it, but I dreaded logging in each day and reading all about what was wrong with me, from someone who didn't really know me that well.


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#14
AL2009man

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Yeah, I've had that happen.  I don't edit my levels to please other people if it's not what I want to do.  I take their comments into consideration, but after all it is my level, not theirs.  Some people just can't state their opinion and then move on.  It can get nasty.

 

I had to block someone for that very reason.  I was getting 5-6 messages each day attacking me personally.  I hated to have to do it, but I dreaded logging in each day and reading all about what was wrong with me, from someone who didn't really know me that well.

 

here's a problem, knowing people can be abusive with LBP's Report System, I must take a risk.

 

I considered that level the most controversial LBP Lvls I've ever created. I can go ahead and do a story about it, but I would go off-topic on it.



#15
blacksackman

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Yeah, I've had that happen.  I don't edit my levels to please other people if it's not what I want to do.  I take their comments into consideration, but after all it is my level, not theirs.  Some people just can't state their opinion and then move on.  It can get nasty.

 

I had to block someone for that very reason.  I was getting 5-6 messages each day attacking me personally.  I hated to have to do it, but I dreaded logging in each day and reading all about what was wrong with me, from someone who didn't really know me that well.

 

Trust me, I've been through worse. If you have played LBP for more than 7 years like me you will have experienced all that nasty stuff many times. In LBP2 I once had a hater that went too far. He impersonated my name. After doing this he had a platform from where he could have my name saying very bad stuff. It was abusive to the highest point. Of course there's suicide threats and that but I don't see them as dangerous because they're just words after all. This kid was impersonating my name, publishing a bunch of levels with pictures of me saying stuff that I had no clue about. Pretty nasty. 

 

Blocking him to through LBP.me didn't help. I even blocked him through PSN, but he could still publish levels on his own containing those nasty stuff about me. So I used his own weapon against him, levels. I made a sort of explanation to all of it, revealing the fraud he was, ending his reign. After that he never returned. Happy ending after all, but sometimes you have to put effort and work into removing these haters out of existence. Blocking them does not always help... or reporting for that matter. 


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#16
katanagirl1

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Yeah, I guess I was lucky in the fact that blocking stopped things.  This person was not a creator.

 

It's sad that the people who do the most damage are the younger players, in general.  Just a reflection of society nowadays, I guess.


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#17
Merlin

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But no matter what, the privacy settings are increasing and soon you will be able block just about everything... Why not add a feature that makes your name invisible to other players as well? It wouldn't surprise me if they add this feature in future games.... Remove those walls and open up your mind to opinions from other people!

 

When talking about absolute freedom of speech the first wall people put up is their identity. If there's no name of substance to attack or defend you effectively sidestep many of the issues raised here.

If the act of publishing was an act of selflessly giving stuff away it would temper the worse excesses of artists, both for people with mountains of ego and for the meekest of souls. The determinate of the content of communication is its medium, or the process of its submission: for scientists it's peer review, for citizens it's common courtesy. What people are grappling with then is what is 'common courtesy' for artists like us? Since artists are the dregs of society, maybe a step up from thieves and murderers, the answer must be suitably accommodating.

LBP was established at the start of Web 2.0, before anyone knew where it would go, as Alex and Mark stated in interviews at the time. The idea of people sharing, rating and commenting on things fairly was utopian, people are a little wiser now. That's why people have turned to programs like Yik Yak, Snapchat, Whisper, etc, which ostensibly allow unfettered anonymous communication. From what we've seen so far it looks like Dreams has learned some lessons on this front.

The push in the opposite direction, i.e. consolidating user identity, is being pursued by communist institutions like academia, government, and mass-surveillance agencies. This was on the back of the mass-migration of plebs to sites like Fagbook and Twatter. However, there's a new generation now that's been more correctly inoculated into my internets.


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#18
ramkibainu

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it's an interesting topic, I understand why people disable reviews and comments, just remember what happened to Ariana, she disabled the reviews and comments on her team pick level because many people posted ofensive words.

personally i not disable or erase comments, because those that insult me, hide behind cat photos or cartoon characters on their profiles instead of using their real photos, aside from being idiots, they look like cowards.
the coments/reviews allowed me to meet an interesting girl form UK and now we are friends, so it's something positive.

people have the right to having their own opinions, but at the same time they are obligated to show respect... before say that a level is bad, you have to think: the level was made by a young inexperienced creator? maybe he/her made the level without help?
creators not receive a single dollar for plays or hearts, at the end what moves creators is the same thing that moves trolls and asskissers: ''to being famous''.
even if is a false sense of importance all the people wants to be recognized, creators in a positive way, trolls in a negative way

 

some things that can help on these issues:
-automatically adding the credit on the badge of the level, could reduce the amount of copiers and trolls.
-making that option of blocking individuals to prevent them for posting reviews/comments

i'm not saying that it's a magical solution, I wonder how Dreams will manage this... or it will be a disaster if the creators feels attacked again.


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#19
Pookachoo

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it's an interesting topic, I understand why people disable reviews and comments, just remember what happened to Ariana, she disabled the reviews and comments on her team pick level because many people posted ofensive words.

personally i not disable or erase comments, because those that insult me, hide behind cat photos or cartoon characters on their profiles instead of using their real photos, aside from being idiots, they look like cowards.
the coments/reviews allowed me to meet an interesting girl form UK and now we are friends, so it's something positive.

people have the right to having their own opinions, but at the same time they are obligated to show respect... before say that a level is bad, you have to think: the level was made by a young inexperienced creator? maybe he/her made the level without help?
creators not receive a single dollar for plays or hearts, at the end what moves creators is the same thing that moves trolls and asskissers: ''to being famous''.
even if is a false sense of importance all the people wants to be recognized, creators in a positive way, trolls in a negative way

 

some things that can help on these issues:
-automatically adding the credit on the badge of the level, could reduce the amount of copiers and trolls.
-making that option of blocking individuals to prevent them for posting reviews/comments

i'm not saying that it's a magical solution, I wonder how Dreams will manage this... or it will be a disaster if the creators feels attacked again.

 

You actually can block individuals, you have to do it through LBP.me - although personally I think that option should be right in the game :)

 

In Dreams, anything you publish will have your name attached to it permanently. Whether it's a whole "dream" or just an individual object, no one will be able to take credit for something you've created. 


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#20
katanagirl1

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ramkibainu, I couldn't envision a situation where so many people would leave offensive comments and cause someone to disable them.  It is sad that it would come to that, and to such a nice person too!  It's the state of things nowadays I guess.  Thanks for helping me see it that way.

 

Pookachoo, I was able to block someone on PS4, not lbp.me, because they were on my friends list.  I didn't think about it, but are you not able to block someone who is not your friend on PS4?  I would be good to know.  I guess I assumed you could just search for their username and block them there.


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